2005-11-28

To dispel another myth: "China finding excuse from Yasukuni to instill popular 'hatred' to Japan"

The Asiapage quoted Japan Today about China asking W Bush to persuade the Japanese hardliners to stop visiting the Yasukuni shrine.

The pro-Yasukuni camp and the China-demonizing camp have been pouring myths like these, e.g.
  • "The Chinese Communist Party, for lack of a better way to vent popular restlessness and rationale for demonizing Japan, are picking at an historical wound and refusing to let it heal." - Naruwan Formosa

Most analysts believe China used the popular discontent (in spring 2005) to support its position on the UN Security Council issue. And it might need the excuse when Japan renews its bid to UNSC again. So solving the Yasukuni problem may weaken China's objection on Japan's bid UNSC.

The question is, which of the following represents China's objective

  • As China announced, "You can be a normal nation if and only if you behave like normal nation" - i.e., Geneuinely wants to solve the Japanese militarism revisionist problem, (Yasukuni being the major problem, textbook the other) and is willing to accept Japan as a "normal" nation once it behaves like Germany, or once it is clear that militarism revisionism will not revive.
  • The myth as believed by defenders of Japan's right wing or advocates of "China containment" - To continue using the Yasukuni as an exccuse to "demonize Japan"

The conversation between Hu and Bush provides us with a crucial data point in finding the truth.

If your objective is to instill hatred, you would like to keep the 'excuse' to feed on it. The myth will not be contradicted if China would keep protesting, knowing that LDP would not back down. But then why would it try to solve the problem by asking Bush to mediate and persuade Japan? Wouldn't this eliminate "a better way to" rant?

18 comments:

denk said...

hello sun bin,

whats up with the peking duck blog, i dont seem to be able to post there anymore, keep getting error code, when i hit the post button, my post wont show up either,

denk

Sun Bin said...

how would i know about their site? :-)
i hope they did not ban you. did you try to post in a different location (IP address)?

Curzon said...

More nonsense. China has made Japan-bashing the national sport as the last defense of the scoundral government as it tries to deflect attention from the massacres of its own people.
http://www.cominganarchy.com/archives/2005/07/13/japanese-textbooks-again/
http://www.cominganarchy.com/archives/2004/11/11/why-do-china-and-the-koreas-hate-japan/

Sun Bin said...

I thought about suggesting China to build a SARS Museum or Songhua Nitrobenzene Museum, so that people will learn from the mistake and be vigilant in future.

But I am afraid you are going to label me as a SARS-hater, and accuse me of making napththa-bashing China's national sport.

Sun Bin said...

Curzon,

btw, you were quite careful in the wording in your 'hate' post. I was trying to quote and link to it in the text above but I couldn't find the "deflect attention" words there.

denk said...

Sun bin,

I hope that’s only a temporary glitch over there., after all they promise not to delete any posts.

Curzon,

One poster in that link provided by you said that writing history book is japan’s internal affair, china should clean its own act before poking its nose in others “internal affairs”
Since u link to it as your support, surely u agree with that, -- writing history book is an internal affair.

Lets say tomorrow the ccp decides to fan hatred towards the us, or whichever country you are from, it orders a new set of textbooks which claim that your country dropped A bombs on china in 1960 killing 10 million people. Would u jump thru the roof or would u tell yourself calmly , oh its their internal affair, none of my business.

Japan is whitewashing a part of history that cost 20 mil Chinese lives, but u say china has not right to protest.?
What can be more international than an aggression that cost 20 mil lives, u call that japan’s internal affair?

http://search.japantimes.co.jp/print/opinion/eo2005/eo20050530gc.htm

if the japanese history books tell their children pearl harbour was a fabrication, its also their internal affair too?

is that so difficult to understand , or are people like you just too bigoted to admit the fact?

denk said...

Curzon,

Its better to use our own judgement than to google for anything on the net that fits your opinions, there are lots of craps on the net, like the one u just linked to.

I wrote this letter to bbc
Xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

the Japanese PM is apologizing for Japan AGAIN, , so whats new, -- where is the sincerity?
Firstly, Japan had offered written apology to Korea and Holland, but not China, by far the worst victim of the imperial Japanese army. If this wasn’t a calculated affront then I don’t know what is. Secondly, while China suggested the dispute over sovereignty on the Diaoyu isle be put on hold until a solution be worked out, Japan has moved to formalize its occupation of isle to make it a fact accompli. Thirdly, Japan has declared that under the US Japan defence pact, it has the right [sic] to defend Taiwan. I wonder how the Japanese would feel if China declare that it assume the “right” to defend Okinawa if the Okinawans , many of whom are dissatisfied with Japanese rule, decide to secede from Japan? This is actually an unfair comparison, while Okinawa was an independent country until it was annexed by Japan in 1879, Taiwan was Chinese territory until it was robbed by Japan in 1839. So for Japan, whose aggression against China dates back to the Ming dynasty when Japanese pirates terrorize Chinese coastal towns, to assume the role of protector for Taiwanese separatists today is like rubbing salt into old wounds.
I am aware there are many Japanese who are genuinely remorseful of their past, I have the greatest respect for them, but their government’s renewed militarism and provocations against China and Korea show that just like before WWII, a nation of fine people is being hijacked by rabid rightists who aspire to a greater Japan and think nothing of trampling on the feeling of Japan’s ww2 victims. From what I hear from the likes of Ishihara and his ilks, they probably wouldn’t mind going to war with China again either -- One right wing nut had actually uttered these words, “lets see who will win this time…..
It doesn’t matter how many times Japan has apologized, action speaks louder than words. This textbook whitewash of history is just the latest in a long list of provocation. To all those, especially non Japanese, who accuse China of harping on history and trying to milk Japan’s non existent guilt complex for all its worth, -- save your prejudices, try putting yourself in China’s shoes, would YOU forgive someone who say sorry to you but keep stepping on your toes?


Denk

Xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Oh they didn’t published it,

Now thanks to sun bin’s blog, my letter got to see the light,
If u think my rants is nonsense, tell me why.

Anonymous said...

Denk,

Taiwan is a Taiwanese territory! You remember that, and remember it well! Why don't you go shit more on your Chinese people as the usual, so they get pay less than $2 a day?

BTW, what year do you live at? WW2 is already ancient history. We, Taiwanese, don't live in the past like you, slave of Chinese culture!!

Another Chinese from Taiwan said...

Dear anonymous,

Yes you can call yourself Taiwanese, but don't forget you are Chinese also. Mrs Annete Lu called herself "a proud Chinese." Your skin and your hair from your body came from your parents, who came from your grandparents who were all Chinese. You know people who disrespect or curse their parents, commit the biggest sin of all. My dear fellow Taiwanese friend , do you hate your mother and father as being Chinese who enslaved you to this horrible Chinese culture???

Yours Sincerely,
Another proud Chinese originally from the Taiwan Province of Republic of China

denk said...

kinda wierd , i cant post to the pekingduck anymore,

anymore,

Here is another one from a true Taiwanese,

Congratulations sir, on a job well done. From the first word to the last in this article, I sensed no bias, unlike the editors from all those major newspapers around the country. I was born as a Chinese in Taiwan and I really think US is just bullshitting on protecting democracies in southern Pacific first then protecting US interests later. United States has no sovereignty in Far East yet always meddling those countries' own affairs. I truly believe without US nosing around, lots of tensions wouldn't have created in the first place. You don't see Russia or China send their warships to South America just so the trade route of coca to Asia wouldn't be interrupted.

Dai Lung Liu


http://www.g2mil.com/June2001Letters.htm

denk said...

oops, dai lung liu was referring to this comment

http://www.g2mil.com/May2001.htm

MoMo said...

Sanoji on Curzon's thread (controversial textbook) makes a familar refrain: if China won't revise its textbooks, why should Japan, since both can claim `internal affairs'.
It's that same `if Japan is bad, China is worse' line, again.
There's an underlying implication that a communist country, where everything is controlled by thought police (ye gawds!) does not have the moral right somehow to criticise a one-party democracy, even if it's a deeply concensual country where the rightist-dominated government has de facto power over the key segments of life. Wasn't it just the 1980s when the West decried a Japan Inc monolith?
All countries write and rewrite history to fit a national agenda. In Malaysia, for instance,textbooks do not mention those watershed events 36 years ago.
The country has prospered, so the issue does not matter.
In Japan's case, the textbook issue is different, since it is a component of the push since the 1980s by Japan's rightists to re-militarise and reclaim the country's international position (ie, a `normal' nation).
A country that diminishes its unprovoked war into bland words such as `incident' (massacre) or `advance'(attack), and identifies its former victim as `a security concern' causes disquiet in the region about its future intent as a re-armed nation.
The irrepressibly liberal Mr Rumsfield of USA, which Mr Taro Aso has re-affirmed as its key ally, has demanded an explanation from China for the rapid modernisation of its military - which many analysts actually say beginfrom a very low base.
As Ihave told Mr Kushibo on his blog, the view from this side of the Pacific is very different.
Malaysia and Indonesia do not see China as a threat. Singapore's economic ties with the mainland are close, while even Vietnam will choose to be friendly - even if not friends - with China.
It is Japan's remilitarisation that is raising questions, as voiced in a recent Singapore Straits Times editorial.
The war in the Chinese diaspora against the textbook revisions and the Yasukuni shrine, is all due to the uncertainties of a re-armed japan that has not declared itself.

denk said...

Ok its official now, I cant post in pekingduck anymore, “they” will have their last word as always..

Someone told me,

-------------------
Maybe you got banned from BBC, Asia Times, and other media outlets for
simply not making any sense?
Posted by Kevin at December 1, 2005 11:05 PM

-----------------------
but didn’t tell me why the bbc letter doesn’t make sense, lol

I think the last straw for them must be this one,

http://www.iso.org.au/socialistworker/507/p2f.html

jeeze, imagine they were clamouring for usa and japan to protect Taiwan,
so who will protect the world from the sheriff, the no 1 threat, eh?

They just cant handle the truth after living so long in self delusion, imagining themselves the protectors of the world.

Sun Bin said...

you are always welcome to post here, and i also suggest simonworld's forum. i hope it would be a neutral and much better organized site for discussion.

Sun Bin said...

momo,

there are always some bigots who refuse to look at facts and follow logics. we only have so much time educating them.

i think as long as we presented the fact fairly, the readers will determine who is being honest. this is what i am interested in. i have never planned to convince the bigots.

denk said...

Thank you sun bin,
If its alright with u I invite any poster in pekingduck who disagree with me to continue the discussion here, but then I don’t think anyone will take up this offer anyway, since they can have the last word over there ;-) wink wink

In a way I could understand , if u are steeped in bs all your life and one day the truth hit u like a 100 ton locomotive, u wont be able to handle it, the only way is to blank it out of your mind. I think in psychology they call it self denial.

Take a look at this post at that wonderful site, the freerepublic,
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1336484/posts

I have seen lots of bs coming from the land of (dis)information, but they really surpass their own standard with this one, don’t waste time on those long rants, its all craps, but look at this,

Comment #59 Removed by Moderator

Comment #60 Removed by Moderator

Comment #61 Removed by Moderator

Comment #62 Removed by Moderator

Those were my posts,

Now what did I do wrong,?
I simply produce evidence showing that the Nepalese don’t blame china , they in fact summoned the Indian and brit envoys and gave them a dessing down for conspiring to interfere in napalese internal affair. (sound fammiliar? )

India in particular was denounced for its duplicitous role, in supporting the army overtly, while propping up the rebels covertly,!!!

Without blinking an eyelit,
They removed my posts, but kept the bs.
Then go on like nothing has ever happened.

Jeeze,
Welcome to the land of mushrooms,
Where folks are fed bullshit and kept in the dark all day, like mushroom,
Hell they seem to prefer that way too, ;-)

like u say, how can one reason with mushrooms?

Sun Bin said...

i didn't follow that discussion.

yes, everyone is welcome to discuss here.

but since blog posts got displaced by new posts, for more lasting topics i suggest we do it in
this forum or that forum

MoMo said...

Mr Sun Bin,
Thank you. I posted here to make a point, but also with a sense of humour, following Travan's advice not to continue the debate on Curzon (though he has not banned me...yet. ;O)
For anyone following the sequence of events up to the upcoming EAC summit in Kuala Lumpur, you will see that Japan is wavering over the issue. The Daily Yomiuri blames Beijing now for `blatantly' attempting to sideline Japan